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SLEEPiNGGiRL

Jebero/varadero

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Finally we are about to collect our first frogs, a 2:3 group from John on here. I'm extremely excited, as I fell in love with the varadero the first time I ever laid eyes on them, but never thought I'd have them any time soon.

I have a few questions that I'm hoping someone may help with concerning the group. This is a proven adult group, so I'm expecting the high possibility of egg laying and tadpoles quite soon, sooner than if I was to get froglets. Feels a bit like diving in at the deep end, but I learn fast!

My question pertains to the group. Right now I have reservations about keeping them as a group due to everything I've researched and drawn from the experiences of those that have been in this hobby a long time. Every opinion almost seems to be to keep a 1:1 or 1:2 for the best success. John assured me they're are all fine together in his his care and it's worked well. My concern is me... being so new to this and my viv, an 18x18x24" exo being only 6 months or so old, so not excessively planted or overgrown as such. Right now it has 2 fireball offsets and a pauciflora in flower so that should shortly start to produce pups. I've added 3 film canisters to the side of the viv also. I also have another viv I could split a pair into for now.

If my 24x18x36"h was ready and fully planted, I'd be less concerned about keeping them all together, but again, these are my first frogs and I'd always intended on just a pair per per viv to give maximum space and an increased territory size. I was thinking maybe I should split these into a trio and pair?

 

Would love any thoughts and advice.

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Nick    447

From my experience I had 1:2 and one of the females just got thin and died once she was out of the way the 2 remaining start to breed quite quickly. There's a article about saying these are monogamous frogs in the wild. If think these would be better off as pair or as a large group to help decrease the chance of bulling a bit like pumilios. See what other member's experiences are they might have different take on it as frogs can differ.

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2010/02/monogamy-seen-amphibians-first-time
 

 

Nick

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kevindurose    111

I agree with Nick, a lot of thumbnail frogs are highly territorial and with a small group the subordinates may end up wasting away and dying through stress. As Nick says in a larger viv or a larger group the bullying gets shared out there may not be a problem. I believe there is a similar situation with some tropical fish such as tiger barbs, it's either 1 or a group where the bullying gets shared out.

Kev

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Thanks guys. This is the viv in question, I just added another fireball brom for more hiding places, but as you can see, things are still growing in. The underneath of the driftwood cave area is packed out with leaf litter. Do you think it's enough for a group to live peacefully? I'm concerned that there isn't much territory definition? I don't want a froggy death on my hands, if I can do my utmost to prevent it from even starting in that direction.

 

20160218_154649_resized.jpg20160218_154718_resized.jpg

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Well, we went with putting the whole group in together for now and will watch their behaviour. 3 are very bold and the one male has not shut up since 10 minutes of being in there. He seems to follow and attract what I think is his paired female, but now has another lighter and larger female (I think) following him everywhere! LOL There's now 4 of them up in the broms, but only one calling. The other is still hidden away in the leaf litter I think. Would this be the other male or probably the unpaired female?

 

Either way, astounded at their boldness already. In love with the little guy's voice too. :D Thank you so much for all your help and for letting us have them John!

 

The male

Varadero%20-%202.jpg

 

The preferred/paired female?

Varadero%20-%201.jpg

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Stu    426

Stacey, John's a good keeper plus these guys have so far been happy together,i'd set up a little tub seed it with microfauna a few cheep good in low light plants  plenty of leaf litter and just have it sat there in case. I have no experience with imis,but I'd have a get out clause in place as we always do just in case. Both Kev and Nick's advice I'd deffer too they both have more experience than I with imis,but so often I feel the individual frogs make the rules the individuals either get on or don't.

All the luck mate cracking pictures

 

Stu

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Thanks Stu! Fingers crossed they keep the harmony they had previously, but me being me, I already anticipated any problem and set up a small viv with a bit of wood, cork bark, plants, seeded etc... any excuse! LOL I figured that it would be useful for any unforeseen illness, injury, aggression etc... can you see where this is going? I just happened to measure some dead space yesterday... would fit 4 x 40x40x60 vivs nicely. :-p

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JohnB56    319

Hi Stacey,

Glad you're happy with them!

 

As I said before they have lived together peacefully with me for a long time. Sometimes you do have to be careful when moving them to a new habitat, as it sometimes triggers territorial behaviour, but you seem to be well prepared for that eventuality.

 

Like Stu, I also believe that some frogs are individual, and don't always behave in the way which we would normally expect.

 

Anyway I hope you enjoy them.

 

Nice photos BTW.

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Hi John,

 

I'm over the moon with them and so glad I changed my mind! :) I'll be spending a lot of time tank watching for sure. I didn't want to bother them too much and the photos were taken through the glass, but once they settle, I'll hopefully get some cool shots. Thank you again!

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kroot    256

Congrats! First eggs are always a massive thrill. Luckily it still is after many clutches, seeing eggs always makes me smile. Yes even the tricolours. Love Imis one of my favourites. Good luck with them.

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Thank you! :) I'm not sure if they've already put some anywhere else previously, as I dont like pulling the plants about to pry, but these were laid last night after the lights went down and in full view of the front of the tank, so fingers crossed, I get to watch them develop day by day if the eggs are good. One (the bottom one) is much smaller than the other two eggs. Feeling pretty excited and blessed to have a front row seat to be able watch and hoping to get a few macro shots, without disturbing mum, who is keeping a good eye on her future kids right now. :)

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kroot    256

My other half is always better at spotting eggs than me. I've only ever seen two laid clutches in one of my imi vivs. They very good at sneeking them where I can't see. Not hiding them. just being awkward. have fun.

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Here's a better photo. One egg is quite a bit bigger. Do you think they're looking ok? I was thinking maybe I missed one and she's since laid two more next to it? If they do this? I wouldn't be surprised if there's more in there, I see her going back and forth deciding between two broms, like last night, but it could also be their first clutch.

Eggs1.jpg

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

The first tadpole now has back legs, 6 weeks and 1 day after breaking out of his egg, plus I then found another two eggs today about to hatch out in the next few days and dad has only just moved the other(s)! These frogs have been busy whilst I wasn't watching!

FB_IMG_1462013950371.jpgFB_IMG_1462013958207.jpg

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Their home, a 45x45x60cm Exo, my first viv build, picture taken today. They seem to like it. I'm adding a Ficus Panamanian sp in the next few days, but this viv has been growing in for a good 4-5 months now. It's even sprouted an noid plant, an Alocasia I believe (covered in the carotenoids on the left).

 

45x45x60%20exo%2010-05-16.jpg

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gouldianmax    406

I would stick with thumbnails if you like really nice plants in your viv's as the larger dartfrogs seem to be intent on trampling and flattening every nice plant i put in my viv's lol.

 

regards

 

Gordon

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SLEEPiNGGiRL    94

Unfortunately I have little room right now and would not be in the good books if I filled the house with vivariums. Fortunately though, I have fallen in love with thumbs, Ranitomeya I think will always be my first choice. I currently have one tank to house more frogs and I'm putting an order in for another 3 (he doesn't know yet!), then I think I've hit my limit. I've already pretty much decided on what is going in those 3 too, even if it takes years to get them! This hobby has been so fulfilling, exciting and addictive, it's extremely hard to draw a limit line. :D

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